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Mark Ferguson from neXtgen Agri brings you the latest in livestock, genetics, innovation and technology. We focus on sheep and beef farming in Australia and New Zealand and the people doing great things in those industries.
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The "Sheep Poo" Study with Beef and Lamb NZ
This week on the podcast we have Cara Brosnahan from Beef and Lamb NZ (B+LNZ) discussing the latest research being done to gauge the prevalence and impact of facial eczema (FE) in New Zealand.
As the global climate shifts, the disease is migrating further southward, causing new challenges for regions and livestock previously unaffected. B+LNZ are trying to understand the spread and severity of the disease, with the aim of devising effective strategies to manage it.
North Island farmers will be very familiar with what FE is - for those that aren't, sheep and cattle consume a toxin known as sporidesmin, produced by a fungus living in the pasture, which causes liver damage and subsequent photosensitivity, resulting in the clinical sign of facial eczema. Subclinical signs of the disease can lead to significant liver damage, reduced production, fertility issues and - in dairy cattle - a drop in milk production.
B+LNZ's three-year research endeavour aims to enhance understanding of the prevalence of facial eczema in New Zealand and the impacts on livestock in both the North and South Islands of New Zealand.
B+LNZ need 350 dedicated farmers (with 22 participants from each of the 16 regions across New Zealand) to gather samples between October and May for three consecutive years. The objective is to obtain a comprehensive nationwide understanding of facial eczema, regardless of previous farm exposure to the condition.
B+LNZ will provide sampling kits and cover the cost of shipping samples to the laboratory. Study participants will be responsible for collecting samples from the ground, approximately every two weeks, amounting to 16 collections from their flock of sheep each year during the research period.
Farmers interested in participating in the facial eczema research study can express their willingness to participate by registering their details below.
https://www.cognitoforms.com/BLNZGenetics/FacialEczemaThreeYearResearchStudy
Head Shepherd is brought to you by neXtgen Agri International Limited. We help livestock farmers get the most out of the genetics they farm with. Get in touch with us if you would like to hear more about how we can help you do what you do best: info@nextgenagri.com.
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Welcome to the Head Shepherd podcast. I'm your host, mark Ferguson, ceo at Next Gen Agri International, where we help livestock managers to get the best out of their stock. I want to take this opportunity to thank our friends at MSD Animal Health in Orflex for sponsoring Head Shepherd again this season, and I'm also excited to introduce our mates at Inega as brand new sponsors of the show. Msd in Orflex, or perhaps better known as Cooper's Animal Health in Australia, offer one of New Zealand, australia's, largest livestock product portfolios, with a comprehensive suite of animal health and management products connected through identification, traceability and monitoring solutions. Like us, they see how the wealth and breadth of information born out of this podcast can help their men and their farming clients achieve their mission of the science of healthier animals.
Mark Ferguson:Heininger will need little introduction to our audience. A market leader and one-stop shop for wool harvesting and animal fibre removal, together with an expanding range of agricultural products and inputs, the Heininger name is synonymous with quality, reliability and precision. The Heininger team have a deep understanding of livestock agriculture, backed by Swiss engineering and a family business dedicated to manufacturing the best. It's fantastic to have both of these sponsors supporting us and bringing Head Shepherd to each week, and now it's time to get on with this week's episode. Welcome back to Head Shepherd. This week we've got Dr Cara Brosnahan. How are you, cara?
Kim Kelly:Great, thank you.
Mark Ferguson:Are you the principal advisor in animal health research there at Beef and Lamb? It's a fairly impressive sounding title.
Kim Kelly:It is. It's always good to have those long worded titles that no one really knows what they mean.
Mark Ferguson:Excellent, and so today we're going to be talking about sheep poo, which will drop the tongue a little bit, but I thought we'd start off with your background and how you ended up where you are, which will surprise some to hear that you've got a PhD in salmon, of all things, and a bit of a life in marine before you saw the light and moved back to sheep.
Kim Kelly:Yeah, that's right. I do have a background in aquatic animal diseases mainly, which does seem strange that I've jumped into the terrestrial world. So, yeah, I did my undergrad at Victoria Uni and then I did my PhD through the veterinary school at Mass University, as you say, on salmon, looking at diseases that have affected them and why they were having such high mortality, particularly in the mulberry sounds. And then, yes, I jumped over into the land, into the sheep and beef space, and, yeah, this opportunity came up and it was just using the scientific skills that I have. Transitioning them into this realm is not so outrageous when you think about it in terms of the principles of science and disease and animal health in general. I was born and raised on a sheep and beef farm in the South Canterbury, though, so I guess that's always been a part of my life, so it's great to be back.
Mark Ferguson:Excellent. Yeah, I figured you must have been down this way by the last horse at Margaret somewhere on this on this school, so I figured you were down this way. I forget on to facial eczema, which is I used to say was specific to New Zealand, but it's around other places, but obviously a major problem in particularly the North Island and more humid areas. I guess just a bit of background for those out there who haven't aren't aware of the sort of damage that it can do or the sort of history of the disease and what it costs us.
Kim Kelly:Yeah, so facial eczema is a little bit of a misnomer because it is a primarily a disease of the liver and ruminants and camelids.
Kim Kelly:So once they eat pasture, particularly ryegrass, it's caused by a fungi that lives in the pasture and creates a toxin called spritism. So that toxin is actually what affects the liver and then the damage to the liver causes the animal essentially not to be able to break down the grass as well as it should, which causes the clinical sign and that photosensitivity of that facial eczema, so peeling and sunburn of those lighter areas of the skin. So that's the clinical sign of the disease. But also the subclinical signs are really important to notice as well, because there is research done that for every clinical case there could be up to 10 subclinical cases and that's things like liver damage. That can actually be quite significant but you can't really tell, and that will be causing an impact on production. But it also impacts on fertility and fecundity. So it is quite a broad reaching disease, I guess. And the other subclinical impact in dairy cattle is obviously drop in milk production. So if you're not really monitoring and looking for it, those signs could go unnoticed on certain properties.
Mark Ferguson:Excellent. I guess the the challenge or the issue is that obviously, as climates change, then it'll move with theirs, as things get warmer than it's already been Evidence in the south, and I guess we'll continue to march further south, which puts a lot of sheep that are Very susceptible to the disease under under threat as well. So there's time that we get some new tools and new information on the disease.
Kim Kelly:Yeah, definitely yeah, because it is a fungus, as you say. That's going to be very Important as to if the environment changes then it can grow in different places that it hasn't before. Potentially so it could have been sitting in the pasture all over New Zealand but only creating the toxic spores at certain times and, as you say, those naive stock that haven't seen that before. That's gonna be a real concern for those farmers because they're gonna see quite significant disease in their animals potentially and Yep, traditionally new North Island disease, but definitely top of the South Island and even anecdotal reports down to as far as South Canterbury. And so I guess that's part of the reason why we want to look and see what's actually going on and how, how widespread it is and what that risk is to farmers in New Zealand.
Mark Ferguson:Excellent. Yeah, well, the reason we're chatting is because of the profile of the Great Poo collection. The service, the a A project underway still looking for farms to submit samples. So looking to get a obviously a very wide Geographical spread across both islands in New Zealand to get a good handle on where, where we're seeing spores turn up.
Kim Kelly:Yeah, definitely, and we want that have experienced, if he, and also those that have never experienced, because we want to know exactly where those limits are of it occurring or not, another.
Kim Kelly:So, yeah, the prevalence and distribution is kind of the main goal of the study, but we also want to understand some of those risk factors or variables that could be on certain properties that could be making facial Eczema worse, on those properties and can we use that for more accurately predicting it in the future and also to use the information for potential management solutions as well.
Kim Kelly:So we are, after it's quite a large number, 350 farms across New Zealand to collect poo for us and Every couple of weeks and sheep who were doing at the moment, every couple of weeks sending it into the laboratory, which will provide all of the sampling equipment and return Korea tickets and then you'll get every farm, will get their results back, so they get a really good profile of what's happening for them over the season.
Kim Kelly:And we are going to do this for three years. And the reason for doing it over that number of years is because if you're a farmer and you experience, if he, you'll know the variability between seasons. So we want to understand that as well. We can't just do it on one single year and expect that we'll know the answers, and so, yeah, it's for those that are At risk of facial eczema. It's really valuable information for you and for those that don't think they are. It's also really good to understand for the industry how we're tracking and, you know, maybe something will show up that you weren't expecting and you'll be better prepared for this disease.
Mark Ferguson:Yeah, excellent. So I guess I don't have risk factors of pasture type and hill versus flat. All those things will be part of what you find out or study further.
Kim Kelly:Yeah, definitely, and there's a lot we do know, and especially for those farmers that have been experiencing FE for years, they're very adept, I guess, of knowing you know when it's facial eczema, weather, and what paddocks are a risk to them. But for people who haven't dealt with it, that's quite a new thing for them and if we can help provide that support to understand how to farm and manage with it, that will be a goal of this project. But also are there other factors that we haven't considered that could be used as potential management tools or solutions. Also, with the poo we're collecting, we are storing it. So we're going to have a library of poo from all around New Zealand, and the idea of that is so that we can go back to those samples and actually develop more accurate tests, for example, you know, identifying the toxic spores and where they are. So if we could actually identify what is toxic and where, then that could help farmers as well. So that's just an example of what we could do with those with that library.
Mark Ferguson:The world's least visited library.
Kim Kelly:I don't know. I have some draw cards.
Mark Ferguson:That's so many keyway jokes we can run with which we won't see How's the uptake. Have we got all farms signed up or are we still looking for more?
Kim Kelly:No, we're about halfway there. We've got more farms in the North Island, which is expected, obviously, because it is probably higher on their priority list. So we're really keen to get those South Island farmers signed up. We, as a little incentive, there will be 25 farms selected around New Zealand with a focus more on the South Island to also test the poo samples for parasites, and so obviously parasites is another big animal health priority for our farmers. So how can we use these samples to? For cross project use, I guess. So if you are selected, then you'll get thick leg count and larval species identification on your samples every month.
Mark Ferguson:Excellent. So yeah, it'll be a good project to get involved with. Is there going to be a way that if I'm living in I don't know outside of Omorouk and I jump on a website and see my closest farm and what the sport, whether they're found spores or not, is that going to be?
Kim Kelly:Yeah, so we're going to have a live dashboard with all of the results. Not at a farm level, obviously so if you are involved in the study or your personal information remains confidential but at a regional level. We'll have the number of farms that are being tested and what their sport counts have shown. So we'll put that up every couple of weeks when we get the results.
Mark Ferguson:Excellent. Obviously, one of the things that's of interest to us is selecting animals that are less susceptible to the disease and that's been a, I guess, a priority for the industry for a while now. But it has been, I guess, tough going, particularly for the sheep. The current testing is pretty brutal on animals. Obviously, having to dose them with the disease or dose them with the toxin and then see the response is not what anyone wants to do. There is Bephalem got some work underway, or funding some work underway, to come up with a different test or a less invasive test.
Kim Kelly:Yeah, that's right. For the last couple of years we've been looking at that with Axel Heiser from Ag Research, who's leading that project for us. We are looking at certain biomarkers within the blood to see if they show a difference between those tolerant animals versus susceptible. So far we've got a few biomarkers that are looking promising and the next stage will be a bit more analysis before we try and move the test to something that a commercial laboratory could use. So although it's looking really promising, I still can't say that we've definitely got something for sure. But I mean, as you say, it's a really important tool that is needed for the industry.
Mark Ferguson:Yeah, excellent. So we have had measurement of GDT levels. Is these additional biomarkers that? So this will be like a natural challenge and then you test animals, or is there some? Is that how?
Kim Kelly:Yes, so the test, how the test would work, is you'd collect your blood sample from your animal, send it to the laboratory and then that blood sample would be exposed to sprodesmin and then that sample would be tested for the particular biomarker. So it is essentially the same principles as the current test, but removing it from the animal and doing it in the laboratory.
Mark Ferguson:Sounds a lot more fun turning your blood to do it rather than because you could send your blood off to operation, wouldn't it be excellent?
Kim Kelly:Yeah, it would be good. Yeah, so we are looking at those thing about timeframes for that piece of work. We should know by the end of the year if we've got something that we can at least trial for farmers to trial.
Mark Ferguson:Excellent, yeah. So again, for those who are outside New Zealand I wonder what we are talking about. But yeah, there's been particularly some groups in the north and some individual breeders have made massive leaps forward in the tolerance of their animals to facial expo or sprodesmin. And, yeah, I guess any tools that allow us to widen that work or even speed that work up is going to aid the industry a lot. And, like everything, I'm pretty passionate believer that genetics can solve all problems and it's just another disease that is under genetic control or animals display differences in their tolerance and so again, we can breed them to handle this challenge, which is, I think, pretty exciting long term, because really other treatments or fixes for facial expo are. There's tools out there, but they're often pretty difficult and you need to be have your timing right and obviously, with the rising costs on farm and animal, that doesn't get it in the first place is a good option.
Kim Kelly:Yeah, and I think that's a good point you raise is that there is no cure for this disease, that's only preventative measures, so that you know. Knowing where you're at and what your spore counts are doing ahead of time is essential for any current management solutions to actually work.
Mark Ferguson:Yeah, and like you say, the clinical signs are obvious, but it's the subclinical damage you're doing year in, year out or on the shoulders of a really intense challenge, that that damage to the liver makes. It obviously makes an animal much less effective, and we've seen it in Australia with other toxins that we do deliver damage and it might be two or three years until you they're under a bit of pressure and then they start falling down on you from a previous exposure to heliotropa or whatever. So it's yeah, there's long term consequences. So an animal that doesn't suffer that damage in the first place is going to be a great one to have and it hats off to all those dedicated breeders who've done the hard yard so far. But it'd be great to help them along a bit and get them a new test or a new method of testing.
Kim Kelly:Yeah, and also to create other tools to go alongside genetics, I guess, because I agree genetics is a great option but used in conjunction with other tools is the most effective.
Mark Ferguson:yeah, yeah, someone always has to bring me back to reality that there's more than just genetics.
Kim Kelly:but no silver bullet. Anyway, I keep trying.
Mark Ferguson:No, that's 100%. We need management and genetic solutions combined to pull that one out, pull that win. A quick interruption here to remind you of Head Shepherd Premium and our consulting services at Next to Niagara International. If you love this podcast and want to hear more of them, visit the hubnexttoagrecom and sign up for Head Shepherd Premium and get an extra podcast each week.
Mark Ferguson:If you're listening to this and thinking you really do want to maximise the genetic gain of your livestock and feel more confident around the decisions you're making on farm, then send me an email at mark at nexttoagrecom and we'll get in touch and see where that takes us. If we go back to some of those samples, are you going to be doing a bit of worm? Testing on Drench resistance is obviously a massive issue, while globally but it seems in the last few years New Zealand have hit somewhat of a wall with triple drench resistance sort of kicking around and with capsules off the market, we've now got a lot of farmers sort of hoping or looking for different ways to handle their internal parasite problem. Beef and lamb got a bit of work underway in that area.
Kim Kelly:Yeah, definitely so. Internal parasites, along with facial eczema, are always the top two animal health challenges that are top of mind for our farmers when we ask them. So internal parasites are definitely a big portfolio of our work. We've got a few things underway in that space and working closely with Jenny Dodunski from Wormwise as well, because a lot of what we need to do is in the extension adoption space, as well as that more long-term vision of what other tools do we need in the toolbox when drenches are failing. So one thing we've got happening is a pilot group of wider upper farmers. It's like a discussion group advancing a bit more on Wormwise workshops and Wormwise principles just to really get into the nuts and bolts of how this group of farmers are dealing with their drench resistance problems and how they're changing farm systems and also incorporating a bit of that actual knowledge about Wim biology. If they're just incorporating everything, I guess the science and the practicalities. And the reason we're doing the pilot group was to evaluate how well it's actually working for the group. Are they actually making changes because they're in the group? How well are they learning? And so far it's been going for a year and it's very positive and the group is. You know, after a few meetings you get more comfortable with each other and being more open and discussing these things. So, because it is showing real value for the group we are looking at, you know, can we roll these out further around the country, because a lot of other programs have obviously shown that. You know, these small working groups or discussion groups are really valuable and especially with such a complex topic like parasites and drench resistance, there are so many options that you could choose for your farm. But actually having that, you know, building your knowledge and having that confidence to try some of these things is, you know, that can be a barrier sometimes. So that's a really exciting project we've got going on.
Kim Kelly:We've also got a group together from different parts of the sector, different representatives and obviously including farmers, to develop a research program. For what does it look like? Where do we need to go with the research, especially in light of drench resistance? So we're working. We had a large workshop at the beginning of the year, which was really high level. You know what are the areas that we need to focus on, what do we actually want out of this? What does success look like?
Kim Kelly:And then we had a smaller working group work together there was a couple of weeks ago and flesh out some of those key themes and ideas of what we might need in there we're working through, you know, collating all of those post-it notes and boards. You can imagine how much information came out of that day. It was quite exhausting, and so that's one thing. And then the other side of that is also reaching out to global counterparts to see if we can actually join together to try and tackle some of these issues, because drench resistance and parasites is a global issue, it's not just New Zealand. So how can we actually work together and really make our funds and resources go further than just if we were working in Asilo and New Zealand? So it's pretty exciting, but it is all very much at the beginning stages.
Mark Ferguson:But yeah, yeah, I mean definitely there's, yeah, obviously the shape industry, while we we in it think it's probably pretty big, but globally it it's a Pimp along the cat and dog, like a lot of the farmers, a good lot of the info, information tool coming out of companion pets really, and so if we can band together with other other sheep interested or other livestock interested people, that obviously Would be a much better spend of research dollars. That's great to hear and looking forward to seeing where that, where that can go. If we get back on to on the Fee and the great pook collection, how do people getting who's best to get in touch with to for farmers to sign up to that?
Kim Kelly:So if you go to the beef and lamb website, you should see a banner saying we need your sheep poo. Hopefully that's the first thing you see. And then you can click, click on find out more, and there's a link to A form which is basically an expression of interest. So there's no, you know, you're not locked in at that stage. You're just saying, yeah, I might be wanting to be involved, and then we'll get back to you with the other information that we require so you can make sure that you do want to commit to Providing samples to us. And then, if that all goes well because there is, you know, a consent form to be filled in, all of that Admin stuff if that is all good, then we'll send out sampling kits to the interested farmers.
Kim Kelly:And I Should say I don't think I said before, but there will be a, an information form that you'll need to fill out at the start of the season, in the end of the season, and that is really the information we need to combine with those Lab test results to fully analyze those risk factors. So that's, we're beginning that information. Yeah, to the analysis with the sport counts so that we can really understand what are those potential other risk factors apart from the ones we know, like temperature and humidity and Aspect. Is there anything else we need to be looking for? And I guess that's why it's really important to have those farms that are not Exposed to fe, so that we can see the difference between the farms that do have fe and don't have fe. What are those differences and how can we actually look into those a bit further and potentially leverage them for management solutions?
Mark Ferguson:Excellent. So we're talking just pushing a mob into the corner and picking up the warm ones. Is that how many samples per collection time?
Kim Kelly:Yep, so there'll be 10 individual samples per collection, and If you have a system that allows you to move them into the corner Gently and leave them for five minutes or so so they can poo and you can get fresh ones, then that's great. If you have a more extensive system, then We'll put out a video as well of what, what kind of poo we're wanting, and you can walk around the paddock and Grab that poo, because we realize that it's not going to be easy for everyone to be able to Move animals into the corner of a paddock. So we will be putting out a video of how to do it. Jenny Dodonski again has done that for us, so that is great. And we'll also need you to measure the pasture. So we'll be sending out a sword stick, if you don't have one already, just again so that we can understand how, how far down, the animals are grazing and again putting that into the analysis.
Mark Ferguson:Excellent. Well, yeah, we would definitely recommend everyone jump on board there and Get involved. Obviously, we all love being consumers of research, but we need farmers to actually some farmers to actually get involved so that we've got that great information to To tell people all about in in future years. So, yeah, anyone in the South Island who hasn't already signed up but doesn't mind the concept of walking around on the Sunday picking up cheap poo and rather than mushrooms, it'll be that sounds pretty lovely, doesn't it?
Mark Ferguson:Yeah, probably not what it's knowing, but anyway that's no true. Awesome. Thanks very much, carol. Great to have you on and great to great to hear more about those, those projects and really important projects for Sheep farming in New Zealand, and we'll have wider applications. So, yeah, thanks for your time and look forward to seeing where it all ends up.
Kim Kelly:Brilliant Thanks for having me.
Mark Ferguson:Cheers. Thanks again to our mates at Honega, who are proud world leaders in the manufacturing and supply professional sheep shearing and clipping equipment. They understand that their customers rely on the quality and performance of their products each and every day. Also, thanks to our friends at MSD animal health and Orflix, they offer an extensive livestock portfolio, focus on animal health and management, all backed up by exceptional service. Both of these companies are wonderful supporters of the Australian and New Zealand livestock industries and we thank them for sponsoring the Hedgehog podcast.
